Leadership – Pastor Gerry Taillon (Eposide 9)
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16 responses to “Leadership – Pastor Gerry Taillon (Eposide 9)”
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The part that resonated with me the post was when Pastor Gerry was asked about common mistakes for young pastors/leaders, one of them is impatience. He shared about how people do not move or change at the rate you necessarily want them to.
I have felt this need for urgent change and growth as I am helping lead the new mission program for our church. I often felt disappointed when not as many people as I thought would apply or the people who seemed the most eager would later on have difficulty committing to the trip. I would expect changes in their heart or results after a few conversations but obviously that was an unrealistic expectation for me.
God has been teaching me that being a leader is seeing the long-term vision of what God is doing with our ministry and more importantly in the lives of each church member. Moreover, God has been teaching me again that it is not me but the Holy Spirit who moves the hearts of people and it is my job to be faithful and patient in this process.
Pastor Gerry’s words were a reminder for me again that I need to be learn to be patient, set realistic expectations and see the long-term goals as I help lead different aspects of our church’s ministry and serve our young adults group. I cannot expect them to change at the pace I want them to because they are not robots, but uniquely created people in the image of God.
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Thanks for the interview and for the insights Pastor Gerry!
Like my brother Moses mentioned, I too really took to heart the topic of “impatience” as a warning for the young (at heart) pastors and leaders.
Although on an intellectual level, I do understand that when functioning as a Pastor to someone, I have no control over the speed of their transformation; or indeed if they transform at all. That is ALL up to the Holy Spirit.
However, it does not stop me from praying for wisdom and clarity of thought; as well as the right posture and words to say to those in my local church that I would love to see transformed.
I have been struggling for a season with many in my local body that seem to be so stuck in their spiritual development. I am not trying to sound self-righteous, I’m hardly “an expert” obviously, but just seeing the kinds of decisions that are being made just makes me feel more empathy (and conviction) to pray that God will remove their blindness. Or, if I am the problem, then to really remove the obstruction from my own eyes!
It is a constant, realistic reminder to myself that I have zero control. I can preach (or teach) all the right things. I can lead through all the right necessary prayers. I can be the hands and feet of Christ, yet there will be some who refuse to let the Holy Spirit convict or transform them.
Let us all combat the attitude of “Nope, I’m good.”!
I pray for all pastors or leaders of a flock, big and small, who are struggling through their own seasons to try and really help the body connect and transform closer to Christ.
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“I did what I love to do” was the first thing that stuck with me. Clearly expressing how he saw most of his leadership has passed and how he was content with it. Gerry considers three mentors of his to be great leaders. Henry Blackaby who baptized him and helped have a theocentric perspective as a leader. Jack Connor taught him to give himself away as a leader for the kingdom of God. Alan Schmidt was the third who helped him serve pragmatically. I loved hearing that other believers helped him in unique ways in his own leadership and relationship with God. All kinds of disciple makers to form a disciple.Relationship that leads to trust is the most important thing in leadership. Deposit into it more than withdrawing. Gerry believes God gives picture promises. Often it comes to leaders and we see it throughout scripture. I would have loved to have known more about that.The leadership mistake that caught my attention was impatience. I have been full of unrealistic ambition that impacted people around me in an unhealthy way. I will do some more thinking on this. The short moment of Gerry sharing about his wife helped me. I needed the reminder that my wife and I process differently and it is valuable for her to do that in the way she can. I also appreciated the challenge for us to have people different then ourselves as leaders. Detailed, managerial like people, are a blessing to me. “Every strength has a comparable liability.” That is real I see it more and more as I have matured and it makes me more attentive and cautious.
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Thank you, Ps. Gerry. I’ve always been impressed by Ps. Gerry’s energy and health! One thing I can relate to is not having enough patience with people. Not only does it take time for believers to grow, trust must be earned because one’s office doesn’t necessarily authorize you to change them at the speed you want. I also like how you rightly contrasted one’s gifting with liability. My passion and gifting for intentional, relational discipleship will have its negative counterpart, which is being too demanding or critical. You also suggested that we have trustworthy people outside our ministry sphere with whom we can share (or vent). I currently have a mentor who is not from my church or denomination, and I find it extremely helpful to be able to share with someone who doesn’t have to carry the ministry burden but still understand the dynamics of ministry. Along those lines, is the discipline of re-creation. I’m not active to the point where I can ski, but I agree that we should find the time and activity to help us recalibrate. These days, I enjoy nature walks which is something I can physically do that helps me focus on God’s goodness and faithfulness.
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Having worked with Pastor Gerry, it was fun to hear him in podcast form! Several of the things Gerry shared resonated and challenged me. First, his insight that “relationship that leads to trust is the currency of leadership,” was a helpful reminder that relationship is core to church leadership. It is a constant temptation for some of us as leaders to make demands or use our position to chart the way forward, treating those around us a mere pawns. While I am the type of person who does prefer a less adversarial approach generally, I do feel the temptation to “tell people what to do.”
Secondly, the reminder that a pastor’s role is to comfort more frequently than command from the pulpit is a good one. It reminds me of how the majority of prophetic reform commands in the era of the Davidic Kings were aimed at the Kings and leadership themselves. These two things are related, because often the way forward for those in the pews is to continue to trust and accept that the power to change their situation or even themselves is God’s, not theirs. The church needs to be pointed towards the Lamb, and that means submission and grace, more than it means moving one’s own mountains.
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Thank you so much for your years of faithful service and for sharing with us today.
I really appreciated the conversation around co-vocational leadership. There are certainly days when I feel drained, but I wouldn’t change it for the world. I truly feel that God has created a perfect pairing between my ministry role and my work at the local school.
I have also found it incredibly valuable to have a mentor and friend outside of the places where I serve and work. I’ve been blessed with people who have walked alongside me, speaking into my life, encouraging me, and challenging me to grow in many ways.
Thank you as well for the advice about allowing others to lead while stepping into more of a mentoring role. That was especially helpful, and I will do my best to begin implementing it within our children’s ministry.
I left this conversation both encouraged and challenged. I am grateful for the ways God is already at work, and mindful of the ways He is calling me to grow as a leader who equips and invests in others.
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The topic of leadership and a pastor is one that is probably most talked about. But one must be reminded that Christ is the true shepherd, while we are under-shepherds. Our leadership role is contingent on Jesus as the ultimate authority and leader, and we lead as he leads. As pastor Gerry touched on, relationship is the most important thing in leadership, and that relationship is build on trust. Similarly, our relationship with God is also built on faith or trust, which is one of the reasons we submit to him as our leader and follow Him even amidst doubt.
Another issue that was raised about pastors is the tendency for leaders to be impatient. We have the expectation that the church will change quickly and for the better, but far more often, it moves much slower and we must be reminded of God’s timing. Even in my own church, I think it took about ten years of exegetical biblical teaching to move the congregation from the mindset of biblical eisegesis, and we are still learning as a church how to properly interpret the bible rather than read our own preconceptions into it. Change takes time and willingness, both things that require much patience to nurture.
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I want to express my sincere gratitude to Pastor Gerry Taillon and Dr. Piva for sharing such wonderful content through this podcast.
First of all, the part where you described trust as the ‘currency’ of leadership was fascinating. Seeing it from that perspective and through that analogy really gave me a lot to think about. It made me realize how vital it is to consistently make those ‘trust deposits’ so that I can lead effectively when it’s time to make a ‘withdrawal’.
To share a personal example, I recently took over Youth ministry this March. Even before starting, I had been building trust by playing soccer with the kids, chatting with them, and buying them ice cream. I really felt the fruit of those efforts during the Youth KOSTA event in Vancouver last week. Because we had already built up a strong ‘trust account,’ I was able to exercise leadership more naturally and deepen our relationship even further. It was a firsthand experience of how important those everyday deposits are.
Also, hearing that ‘people are not the enemy’ helped me clearly redefine who my real opponent is in ministry. Your advice for young leaders really hit home, as I realized I’ve been quite impatient lately. I’ve decided to start training myself to endure those moments of frustration rather than rushing things. The ‘5% rule’ is also a principle I want to keep in the back of my mind as I serve.
Regarding ‘re-creation,’ I loved the idea of recovery through hobbies. I think it would be amazing to find a rhythm in my ministry by playing soccer with the youth using it as a way to both bond with them and recharge my own soul. Lastly, the distinction you made between pastoral leadership and being a CEO was very eye-opening. It reminded me that a Christian leader isn’t just a manager, but someone who must perfectly harmonize grace and truth, just like Jesus did.
Thank you also for the funny stories at the end. I truly appreciated every bit of this podcast. Thank you again!
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The interview with Pastor Gerry Taillon presents leadership as deeply rooted in character and relationships rather than position. One of the most impactful ideas is that leadership is built on trust. When people trust you, they are willing to follow. I appreciate his analogy of leadership as a “bank account,” where trust is deposited over time through consistent integrity and care. This reminds me that influence is not automatic with a title but is something that must be earned relationally.
His discussion on young leaders being impatient also stood out to me. Change does not happen at our desired pace, and people need time to grow. I can relate to this personally, as I often move more slowly and prefer to think carefully before making decisions. I’m thankful for people around me who are patient with me while also encouraging me to move forward. At the same time, I see how important it is to have others who challenge me and even confront me when needed, because growth often comes through discomfort.
I also resonated with the importance of knowing who I am, my strengths, weaknesses, and what I need to say no to. Leadership requires self-awareness and the humility to surround myself with people who are different from me.
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“You gotta find somebody outside the organization that you can trust…” I love this piece of advice from Gerry. I remember reading in. “Resilient Ministry” about finding people outside the church who will be your confidante and people in the church who will be allies. Leaders need to have that safe space outside of their organization/church where you can be free to vent out without fear of being judged and just allow yourself to process (even if that involves showing your ugly side). That allows leaders to clear their heads and face their people when they are more composed. I particularly like how Gerry framed this to be a way to spare your people from you taking it out on them.
Another thing that stood out for me is the importance of having a team to work alongside you who are also different from you. I think building a core team is something we really need to take our time on, soaking it in prayer, and selecting the right people who have different strengths from us. I’ve always appreciated being in a team where my ideas are challenged and not just always affirmed. It sometimes puts me down when my ideas are challenged but I definitely learned a lot from working with different personalities and set of skills.
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There were two things I especially liked in Pastor Taillon’s perspective, and one I did not.
The first good, was that he would looking back enlist more young men sooner to give them opportunity to preach. I think this is a very useful insight. The pulpit, though important for the spiritual formation of the flock, is not something to be hoarded. We desire to have more ministers about, but we minsiters already serving may not realize we are the choke point! For this reason I have kept an eye out for someone who I may train and begin to equip. I had to wait 3 years before a suitable candidate was available. The wait is worth it though, as I hope to see him flourish and help me cast a bigger net.
The second excellent point was his willingness to enlist opposites. God has indeed given us so many brothers and sisters who are capable of so many things. To ignore certain skill sets is simply foolish and impractical. What’s more, I would consider that the Church, like a family, is made not of who we choose but who we are given. Therefore we should not hinder anyone capable of the work. Our boards and programs will naturally be quite diverse if we obey this principle.
Now the part I did not care for is in regards to vision. He and I might have a strong difference of perspective in how this works. What he described, as a promise with a picture that God gives to people and organizations, which leaders are to discover, does not pass muster. Has God spoken or not? What does it mean to “discover” a vision? How does one differentiate it form whatever whim we have as men? The nail in the coffin would be that it didn’t come to pass as “told”, but this seemed to be brushed off. So to say, these questions give me great pause.
This is a concern of mine, as spending over a decade on Vancouver Island there was a persistent culture of a similar vain of vision casting. Every year it was said that this would be the “year of revival” and great things would happen, if only we’d buy in and seek after this good thing. Now good things happened according to the will of God, but never as proposed. It seems to me, they were speaking for God out of excitment for what ~might be~, but not what they had reason to properly expect.
We ought to be cautious when we claim something as God’s. Wishful thinking is not a good in of itself.
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That’s some great insights from Jerry the Greenhouse Man. Leadership is at the very top of the foundation stones because it takes everything from identity to people skills to build a good leadership character.
For a very long time I thought that leadership requires power, which came from popularity. But what I missed is that leadership requires trust, credibility and integrity. I never saw trust as the foundation stone for leadership because I thought all I needed was enough people sharing my ideas to silence the opposition. Trust is something that I need to build so that people naturally follow me, and not a charismatic persona that I put on.
However, this is also where I disagree with Jerry because he said that trust functions like a bank and that you make deposits every day and withdraw whenever it’s needed. I don’t think trust is like a bank where you deposit and withdraw, because trust can be easily broken and it’s impossible to rebuild it once broken. Personally, I would say that trust is like a car that you build and maintain and keep it well-oiled. However, if you abuse trust for personal gains, it’s like using that car to do something that it’s never intended to do. A car is not meant to be driven underwater like a submarine, and doing so will wreck it. Trust is not meant to be “withdrawn” from the bank for personal gains, and trying to abuse it that way destroys it.
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Thank you for your insights into leadership, Pastor Gerry.
I liked the imagery in how you mentioned that relationships that earn trust are a currency in leadership. This stuck with me along with the need for patience and the recognition that the office does not come with power.
I think I went through a season of a bit of impatience, but a lot of circumstances in my life have put me in a position where I am more than content to wait, see, and enjoy the process of how God is working in my life.
I also appreciated your advice on building a team with people who have strengths where you have weaknesses. This requires a clear understanding of oneself and being willing to step back to let others take the lead.
This was an encouraging conversation, and the story about your lack of patriotism was a good laugh.
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An excellent talk as always. Some great insights are coming from the experience and the constant walk with God.
I liked the aspect that he enjoys doing ministry. the best of a minister comes out when he/she have the conviction to be joyous even while going through the tough times.
I do like the part of vision as well, he shared that God gives you conviction to fulfil certain tasks which He places before you. I honestly believe there cannot be a defining statement to prove the call God place on the heart of a person. It can only be felt by faith. I have the same conviction, and I can certainly echo with what Pastor Gerry means.
Truly an inspiration.
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It was a blessing to hear Pastor Jerry Taillon share his wisdom on pastoral leadership and ministry. I was particularly encouraged by his emphasis on building teams that complement each other’s strengths and weaknesses, keeping people about 75% in their strengths.
This resonated with me deeply because, in my recent ministry involvement, I have seen how much smoother and more fruitful ministry becomes when team members are allowed to operate in their gifting and are supported in areas they struggle with.
I also appreciated his point about creating space for hobbies and rest to refresh the soul. I can relate to this, as I find that taking time for playing soccer outside of church responsibilities and even my own children, helps me process challenges and maintain intimacy with God.
Pastor Jerry’s teaching on leading with grace and servant leadership struck me. I want to emulate this in my ministry journey by prioritizing relationships, mentoring younger leaders, and keeping Christ-centered love at the core of my leadership.
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A really important reminder is to avoid putting God into our limited perspective. Not seeking immediate results is very hard, but it reveals great trust in God and prevents failure in life and ministry decisions. Imposing a limited time frame or a specific method may hinder God from working in amazing ways. Also, we may find ourselves focusing on what God has not given us, like the 5% of people who are not influenced by our ministry, as mentioned in the podcast. I was like Dr Piva in that I focused too much on what I could not achieve, expecting that I should be able to. Yet, I have realised that it is not my work to transform people, nor does this define the quality of my leadership. God has sent me “angels” (some of those whom I serve) to remind me that they are grateful for what I do. I should only be focusing on my loyalty and faithfulness to God, instead of what I have not been given.
Having patience with people is also very precious. We must trust that God is working in them and remind ourselves that it is okay if people do not follow our plan or timing for their growth.
Power does not come with an office. Leaders must realise that people earn their authority not through a title, but through their influence and character. Leaders also need trustworthy, godly friendships outside of their organisation to help them articulate thoughts and vent feelings. It is a pitfall to offload those emotions onto the people you are ministering to.
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Stef Piva 
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